Tag: hospitality

Stéphane Bensimon, CEO of Wojo

In 2019 Nextdoor became Wojo, accelerating its development and creating the ambition to become the leading European coworking network. Two years before, Accor Group, one of the biggest international hotel companies on the planet (operating brands such as Ibis, Mercure, Sofitel, etc.) had taken a 50% share in Nextdoor, by then 100% owned by the real estate company Bouygues Immobilier. We have interviewed Stéphane Bensimon, CEO of Wojo, in order to find out more about the project Wojo and its present and future plans in Europe. Wojo’s CEO will be a speaker at the upcoming Coworking Europe conference taking take place in Warsaw on November 13-15, 2019.

Hello Yoann. A few years ago Accor Group joined Bouygues in the Nextdoor network to develop coworking offerings. Why was this move needed for both players at the time?

A 50/50 joint venture was signed in July 2017. Insofar as Accor hotels were already endowed with shared spaces conducive to meetings and interaction, the idea of offering a place to work (as well as to network) dedicated to clients and local entrepreneurs came to mind naturally. Bouygues Immobilier aims at offering its clients an opportunity to plan shared workspaces (bars, coworking spaces, lounge areas, meeting rooms, carparks) from its design stage and hence help them optimize their business costs. So the fit between both companies was clear.

Nextdoor has become Wojo. Why was a change of brand needed? Is Accor more in the driving seat now?

Accor Group meeting

Nextdoor became Wojo to help its international roll out. Wojo is a spirit – the combination of Work and Mojo. Once Accor took shares in the company’s capital we truly worked hand in hand with Accor’s Innovation Lab’ to define together the future of coworking; true teamwork followed. When the idea of a typology of spaces (“Spots” and “Corners” linked to Nextdoor sites) came about, it seemed clear that we had to reinvent ourselves in order to fulfill  peoples new ambition of working internationally, of working at most ten minutes from where one is living, etc. And no, Accor is not specifically the one in charge. We designed Wojo together and since then we have been standing on our own two feet with its support.

You want to become one of the biggest coworking providers in Europe by 2022. Why are hotel professionals well positioned to serve the flexible workplace industry would you say?

This is because the Accor staff is unrivalled in terms of reception and hospitality and we feel those to be key elements. A friendly dimension is at the core of Wojo’s offering. We welcome our new members through a shared moment, making sure that their days go by perfectly well. Accor has already got hotels ready to welcome clients all over Europe. This makes things easier for us in terms of networking. In the long run, we would like everyone to find a place to work less than 10 minutes from where he/she is located (whether a nomad or sedentary worker).

Wojo space

Workers are forever expecting more services (catering, fitness rooms, concierge services) at their workplace with which hotels are already endowed. According to an Inkidata study conducted in February 2019 for Wojo (results of the study, in french), 48% of French workers would like to benefit from spaces linked to sport or relaxation at the workplace. This is because it is the best way to offer business travellers an opportunity to make up a local network by offering a service that facilitates networking.

48% of French workers would like to benefit from spaces linked to sport or relaxation at the workplace.

Will Wojo’s expansion occur only through the Accor Group properties and hotels network or could we see Wojo spaces in third-party buildings?

By the year 2022 we expect to open 1.200 locations all over France and Europe within Accor hotels. Yet, Wojo Spots and Wojo Corners have been designed to be set up in any third-party location so long as it fulfils a certain number of requirements (high-quality and safe Wi-Fi, furniture quality, acoustics, good working conditions, etc.). In the long run they will be made available in train stations, airports, shopping centres, cafés, etc.

La Salle De Sport

Today, for example, there is a Wojo Spot in LA.SALLE.DE.SPORT with a Reebok concept store and a social club in the very heart of Paris. Not to miss out on anything, the locations that are already open can be viewed on our web app.

Nowadays hotel chains are entering the coworking field in bigger numbers. What does it tell us about the changes in the hotel business on the one hand and the evolving coworking market on the other hand?

Demand, which is directly linked to the revolution coming about in working conditions, is huge and the offerings are equally so. However, quantity does not rhyme with quality. It may appear to be easy to open up a coworking space. Yet in reality one must be in a position to offer a true experience including reception, a secure wi-fi connection, a quiet location, networking possibilities, the right atmosphere, services, etc. Small things (in reality not that small) make the difference. As for hotels: they have been disrupted by Airbnb. They are now in search of something new. By definition, a hotel is equipped as a minimum with a lobby, breakfast room, etc. in which it is tempting to improvise a coworking experience. In the long run we can imagine a client choosing a hotel no longer by pictures of the room or by how clean the spa is, but by the quality of its coworking facility.

As for hotels, they have been disrupted by Airbnb. They are now in search of something new. By definition, a hotel is equipped with a lobby, breakfast room, etc. in which it is tempting to improvise a coworking experience.

Seen from the outside, Nextdoor has positioned itself more in the corporate segment of demand for coworking with spaces located in higher-end business districts. Will Wojo keep positioning itself in that slice of the market?

We understand your interpretation, as Wojos origin comes from an intrapreneurial project on the part of Bouygues Immobilier. The first buildings meeting the conditions for such projects were naturally found in Greater Paris. Yet, from the outset, Nextdoor has had a true willingness to bring together companies of different sizes at one location to encourage open innovation. As a result of its positioning and more concretely speaking its price policy, its community has always been comprised of a host of different profiles. Wojo follows along these lines with its Wojo Spot offer of 9,90 Euros per month with no commitment. We are open to students as well as key accounts. Remote work now concerns all of us and we have at heart to see different sectors of activity, ages, trades come together, truly valuable.

Wojo Paris

Remote work now concerns all of us, and we have at heart to see different sectors of activity, ages, trades come together, truly valuable.

Wojo Spots, Wojo Corners… Is the Wojo offering targeting only nomad workers or longer-term resident workers? How different will Wojos be in Ibis or Mercure from Wojos in Sofitel for instance? What is your approach to segmentation?

There must be no ambiguousness here. Wojos are open to all those who wish to work. It is neither a service reserved for hotel clients nor a service delivered exceptionally to nomad workers. Our aim is to enable travellers and/or nomad workers to meet “locals” and be given an opportunity to network. We are therefore addressing the district’s inhabitants or professionals who are invited to come there to work, near to where they are situated! Nearly all brands are eligible, except for ultra-economical ranges such as Ibis Budget or Hotel F1 or ultra-luxurious ones (such as Orient Express Raffles). The criteria imposed, such as a secure wi-fi connection, reception, reduction on beverages and snacks… are the same for everyone. At this stage we have begun to roll out Spots in France in an economy/mid-range: Ibis Styles, Ibis, Mercure, Novotel, etc. and some are about to open in the high-end/luxury range within Pullman, MGallery and Sofitel. As for Corners, this concerns the same range of brands as Spots.

Hospitality is the number one value proposition offered by hotels. How comfortable are you with the notion of community  as an important factor in the coworking experience?

As mentioned above, one of our strengths lies in the conviviality and good atmosphere that reigns in all Wojos. Furthermore, Wojo does not exist without its community! In addition to shared office spaces Wojo stands on a team of passionate people.

Wojo at Issy-Les-Moulineaux

We thus offer a wide range of business and festive activities in each space throughout the month so as to enable each person to meet others, exchange and learn as well as relax. Community Days for example are held every week in a different space. They enable members to pitch their propositions,  propose a workshop, meet our partners invited for the occasion, invite their clients, attend a conference, etc. Our community also interacts on our digital platform. Discussion and support groups are set up where a program of physical activities is available.

Some experts predict that coworking will represent 20 to 30% of the whole office market by the end of the coming decade. Would you agree with that prediction?

Yes, I believe that is correct. It is more than just a trend. It answers to a need on the part of employees and companies alike, even if for different reasons. Of course we would like to keep up the pace. We plan to open 50 Wojo buildings, 100 Corners and 1 000+ Spots in France and Europe so that members never have to worry about where to set up to work again, hence giving them a guarantee to stay forever connected with their community via our digital platform.

What are Europe’s specific challenges in the field of workplace expectations as opposed to other parts of the world?

There is no specific challenge in Europe compared to other continents. New ways of working are growing everywhere. For example, we see the same trend in Asia with coworking representing more than 3% of office stock in Hong Kong or Singapore. I’m personally convinced that Africa could be a strong coworking market in the coming years. We decided to start Wojo within Europe because of our field knowledge and needs expressed by our current members.

Josh Fine is the COO of Focus Property Group, a real estate operator that not only builds and owns their buildings but operate the businesses that are contained within the building as well, including coworking. We have interviewed Josh Fine to learn more about his experience and knowledge on real estate and his way to understand the coworking and hospitality sector. An interview full of insights and vision on #futureofwork! Josh will also be a speaker at Coworking Europe 2019 this fall.

Hi Josh. Can you introduce the Focus Property Group?

Josh Fine

Focus Property Group has been investing in commercial real estate, primarily in downtown Denver, Colorado (USA), for the past three decades. We acquire, assemble and entitle development parcels, and we develop a wide variety of commercial real estate asset types, including office and coworking, retail centers, hotels, senior housing communities, industrial buildings, and self-storage facilities.

We are long term holders of real estate, meaning that once we develop and lease out our real estate, we continue to manage and own the assets. One unique aspect of our business model is our willingness to create, own and manage operating businesses within our real estate.

In other words, most real estate companies will build and own the buildings but not operate the businesses that are contained within the building. However, we enjoy the entrepreneurial aspect of operating companies. Therefore, rather than build, for example, a self storage facility and then hire a self storage management company to run the business, we created our own self storage brand, hire our own employees and run that business ourselves. It is the same with coworking. We created the Enterprise Coworking brand and all of the Enterprise Coworking employees are on our payroll.

You have been involved pretty early in the coworking wave while investing in hotel industry as well. To what extend are the lines between those “hospitality” driven activities blurring?

Enterprise Coworking, Denver

I am constantly telling our coworking staff that we are in the hospitality business. It has become a mantra of our company. Office space is not new. The innovation of coworking is that it introduces a hospitality or guest services aspect to office space. Our members don’t just want a convenient space to work. They want experiences that will enrich their lives and careers. They want concierge services to help them with all of the challenges that arise during the day so they can focus on what it is they came into the office to do. When a member approaches one of our community managers with an issue, I tell our team to imagine you are at the front desk of the Four Seasons Hotel. Hotel guests are often in disorienting, foreign environments and the hotels that truly shine are the ones where the team makes the guests feel welcome, at ease, and excited to dive in to all of the great things that brought the guest to that city in the first place. It is the same with coworking.

The hotels that truly shine are the ones where the team makes the guests feel welcome, at ease, and excited to dive in to all of the great things that brought the guest to that city in the first place. It is the same with coworking

The spaces that will separate themselves from the competition will have a guest services oriented staff that makes members feel welcome, well cared for, and excited to dive into the projects that brought them into their workspace. Because the service offering is so similar, it is true that lines are blurring between hospitality and coworking. For one, the skill sets overlap so much that many of our best hires come from hospitality. And you see hotels are increasingly getting into the coworking space. Pioneering hotels like the Ace Hotel in New York City, the Hotel Eaton in Washington DC, the Zoku Hotel in Amsterdam, and many others have full fledged coworking spaces and welcome the coworking public to consider the hotel as their living room or office, with free wifi, free-flowing (if not free) coffee and beer and other coworking-like amenities. Business is becoming increasingly nomadic and I predict that we will see more and more joint hotels & coworking spaces that co-locate, share amenities and staff, and synergistically energize each other’s vibes.

The spaces that will separate themselves from the competition will have a guest services oriented staff that makes members feel welcome, well cared for, and excited to dive into the projects that brought them into their workspace

Why does it make sense for a buildings owner company to operate coworking space itself ? Why not partner up with third parties operators?

It certainly doesn’t make sense for every building owner. Coworking is a complex operating business and many landlords simply don’t have the bandwidth or aptitude to run such an intensive operating business. However, the explosive growth of coworking has resulted in a spillover effect where traditional office tenants have come to expect more coworking-like amenities in their office buildings, and office building owners will need to more and more inch toward the type of offering that users can find in coworking spaces. Since office building owners will need to increase service offerings anyway to stay competitive, those who can figure out how to jump into the coworking business will be at an advantage and will also be able to benefit from two profit centers: the rent that the coworking operator pays to the landlord and the operating profit that the coworking operator earns from the members.

Those who can figure out how to jump into the coworking business will be at an advantage and will also be able to benefit from two profit centers: the rent that the coworking operator pays to the landlord and the operating profit that the coworking operator earns from the members.

Enterprise Coworking, Denver

A building owner who reserves part of their building for coworking will likely also benefit from higher overall occupancy. Companies in the building who “graduate” from coworking and want their own space may be able to rent another office space in the same building. And when tenants leave the building, the landlord always has the possibility of expanding the coworking space into the former tenant’s space and thereby gobble up any vacancy immediately. Once a landlord has a successful track record as a coworking operator, it makes it easier for a landlord to acquire or develop additional buildings, because the landlord will have a tenant in their “back pocket” (the coworking space) that can immediately occupy part of a new building.

From the operator’s side, the reason to own rather then rent space is very compelling. In traditional office leasing, there is generally an equilibrium of power between landlord and tenant. Office leases tend to be for shorter periods than retail leases. When it comes time for renewal, the landlord will need to be reasonable and will have to closely reflect market conditions because the tenant can move to a new office building if the landlord tries to increase rent too dramatically. It is certainly a hassle for a company to move, but a CEO can decide to do it and all of the employees will have to follow suit.

But coworking spaces are more like retail users – they are much more tied to their buildings. Just as it is difficult and much more risky for a retailer to move (because there is no guarantee that its customers will all move with it to the new location) so too it is extremely risky for a coworking space to move. The coworking operator can sign a new lease in a new building, but there is no guarantee that the members will follow suit. If the members do not follow, the operator will be starting to build the business all over again. Therefore while building ownership certainly comes with significant risks of its own, it mitigates a major risk of the coworking model.

Coworking spaces are more like retail users – they are much more tied to their buildings. Just as it is difficult and much more risky for a retailer to move, so too it is extremely risky for a coworking space to move.

Do you see a difference in the way coworking spaces are operated between the stand-alone supported-by-a-property-owner-company and franchised/brand coworking spaces? 

We compete head-on with franchised coworking spaces and large brands and I do not believe that members in our space are looking for anything dramatically different. Most members are looking for a vibe that meshes well with their personality and work style, for a convenient location, for robust amenities and for a welcoming and engaging community. One difference I have noticed is that when you own your building there is no passing the buck. Any issue with the building becomes your issue. You cannot blame the building management, for example, if the temperature is too cold or if an elevator is out-of-service.

However, an advantage we have is that when you own the building, anything is possible in terms of dealing with a member issue. Sometimes a member complains about something that the coworking operator cannot control because it is the purview of the building owner and manager. For example, many office buildings have communal restrooms that are maintained by the building management. They may have a snack bar or coffee shop in the lobby. They may have a parking facility used by the tenants. If a member has an issue with any of these things, all the coworking operator can do is complain to their landlord to fix the problem. When you own the building, the buck stops with you. This is both a blessing and a curse. We have the power to fix any problem and can control more completely how our members experience our space. On the other hand, when there is a difficult issue we cannot look to others to address it.

If a member has an issue with any of these things, all the coworking operator can do is complain to their landlord to fix the problem. When you own the building, the buck stops with you. This is both a blessing and a curse.

In the short future, coworking growth is expected to be fueled by Small and Medium size businesses, not only by freelancers and startups. Do you see this evolution coming in Denver? 

Absolutely. The bulk of our membership is small companies with teams of 4-12 people. Freelancers are increasingly becoming a smaller and smaller minority of our membership base. There has been talk for the last several years of enterprise-level companies (with much larger teams of 50+ people) abandoning traditional office leases and moving into coworking. I don’t think we are there quite yet, although there have been some notable examples of large companies moving into coworking spaces in Denver. At our space, we do have some large companies, with our largest company topping out at about 80 employees. However, we have also seen companies move out of our space when they get to 20 or 25 people.

The bulk of our membership is small companies with teams of 4-12 people.

I think it very much depends on the personality of the company. Some companies will always want their own space and will move out of coworking once they reach a certain size. So I think there will always be a market for traditional office space and the obituaries of traditional office space are a bit premature. However, a few companies have grown to love coworking and will stay in a coworking space for as long as they can be accommodated. Spaces like ours that can accommodate large teams will be able to find companies that want to move in. Nonetheless, I think the bulk of the demand comes from small companies, and we are building out new spaces with a heavy emphasis on private suites for teams of 4-12 people.

Companies have grown to love coworking and will stay in a coworking space for as long as they can be accommodated.

In-house Gym, cafés,… We see a race to provide the most exciting, robust and unique amenities in order to distinguish from the competition. How far will it go?

Our flagship location in the RiNo neighborhood of Denver has both an in-house café and espresso bar as well as a fitness center. The types of amenities you need can depend largely on your location. If you have a trendy espresso bar next door, you may not need to offer one in your coworking space. I think the best way to choose which amenities to offer is to make sure there is a diversity of “types” of spaces.

There should be a quiet space for heads-down work where you won’t be disturbed. There should be a buzzing, social space. There should be a networking space that is conducive to impromptu meetings and making connections. In our flagship space, these needs are filled, respectively, by our library, our pub and game room (that we call the “rathskeller”), and our espresso shop. However, other coworking spaces can fulfill these needs with amenities that may be less space- and operationally-intensive.

Shall all those amenities be provided by the same operators? 

I mentioned earlier how coworking spaces and hotels are beginning to “blur” their boundaries and I think that coworking operators to remain competitive will need to learn to operate the same type of amenities as hotels. Just as a hotel doesn’t just need to know how to rent out hotel rooms, but also how to operate a restaurant, coffee shop, gym, pool, event space or conference center, so too will coworking operators needs to establish these competencies. I think that co-locating – especially hotels and coworking – could be a great solution to this operational challenge.

There is a huge overlap between the type of amenities that hotel guests and coworking members want. Shrewd coworking operators will partner with hotels – or join forces and completely merge their businesses – and thus have the scale to offer more robust amenities than either could on their own. Regarding the price, I think a hotel analogy is apt here as well. There is a huge diversity in hotels. You can stay at a one- or two-star motel that gives you very little other than a place to sleep, or a five-star resort that provides a slew of services, like multiple dining venues and bars, a spa and pool, and dramatic public spaces. Of course a guest will expect to pay a lot more for the latter. There will need to be similar differentiation in coworking spaces. However, an operator who wants to charge top-of-the-market pricing will need to offer five-star amenities to retain members.

Just as a hotel doesn’t just need to know how to rent out hotel rooms, but also how to operate a restaurant, coffee shop, gym, pool, event space or conference center, so too will coworking operators needs to establish these competencies.

Would you say it is US specific or are those trends reaching all continents from what you see?

We live in a global village and I am not even sure the trends I described originated in the United States. I just stayed at a hotel in Herzliya, Israel, which was connected to a vibrant coworking space. In the basement was a huge fitness center (much bigger and more elaborate than you would typically find in a small hotel) complete with a dry sauna and steam room. I went down to the fitness center in the morning and it was packed in equal parts by hotel guests and coworking members (as well as people in the community who simply bought a gym membership). This is the type of co-locating and amenity sharing concept that I think will become more commonplace as all of these businesses try to supersize their amenities in an increasingly competitive market.

Innv8 is among the first coworking brand launched in India. Last month, the company was bought by one of the biggest Indian hotel platform, OYO, for a total of 31 millions US$. Meanwhile, OYO announced the takeover of two other coworking brands (PowerStation, for corporations, and Workflow, more focused on startups), demonstrating a strong will to develop its position in the coworking field. Interesting to note, OYO is supported by Softbank, one of WeWork’s main investors. Innov8 is the fourth coworking acquisition by OYO. We interviewed Ritesh Malik, Innov8‘s founder, who used to be a speaker at the Coworking India conference organized by SocialWorkplaces.com, about the vision behind the deal.

Hi Ritesh. Can you tell us the story behind Innov8?

We launched our first centre at the Heart of New Delhi- Connaught in December 2015. We wanted to revolutionise how Indian work. Innov8 is not just a place for people to work, it’s a place for people to connect. We at Innov8 want to transform real estate into a beautiful and premium workspace designed to encourage community engagement for the creators and innovators. In June 2016, US-based fund Y-Combinator backed Innov8 for its investment in the coworking industry.

We were hoping to create a collaborative community where business opportunities and activities can take place freely. We were committed to delivering excellence through design, experience, and services. Our Vision was to revolutionize real estate into beautifully designed, experience centers to empower the process and journey of creating meaningful work. Our Mission: to be World’s Most Loved Workspace brand through excellence in design, experience and delivering value.

Innov8 is now taken over by OYO. Why are the two companies complementary?

Ritesh Malik, Innov8

Innov8 and OYO are both in the business of real estate and hospitality. It’s a perfectly complementary business. OYO already has a strong play in the real estate market worldwide both as a tenant and as a supplier, with existing offerings like OYO Home, OYO LIFE, Weddigz.in and MICE offerings. Also, OYO already has thousands of corporate customers that help generate over 30% of OYO’s business. Additionally, in India, OYO works with over 8.000 asset owners, and many of them have ready space available for commercial business. The decision to, therefore, open managed workspaces is a natural transition and step forward. With vast experience of acquiring properties, creating processes and great user experiences, it will be great backing on Innov8 scalability.

With vast experience of acquiring properties, creating processes and great user experiences, it will be great backing on Innov8 scalability.

OYO is known in India as a hotel booking platform. Coworking seems quite far away from their focus, no? 

Firstly, OYO is not a hotel booking platform. OYO is a full-scale tech-driven hospitality company that operates over 18.000 franchised and leased hotels across 10 countries and 500+ cities globally. Interestingly, the company has globally leased or franchised over 200 million square feet of real estate, and have emerged as a preferred tenant of choice. Thousands of real estate owners around the world work with OYO and respect the company’s ability to upgrade all forms of real estate and deliver good quality experiences. OYO is also amongst the most preferred lesses and franchisors of real estate yields worldwide.

Over the last six years, OYO has invested heavily in building key competencies, where our operational expertise in supply acquisition and management, renovation, operations, revenue management, and distribution, through both offline and online channels, that has helped the company gain significant momentum, and emerge as the most preferred brand in the budget to mid-segment hospitality space in several markets like India and China.

We are certain that OYO’s existing competencies and international reach, will help us seamlessly deliver great quality experiences to our real estate customers as well. We are all therefore excited about our plans to create and deliver chic workspaces that will be designed to provide a hassle-free, comfortable and productive experience to coworkers, and cost-effective workspace solutions to corporates.

According to you, what does the transaction say about the office and workplace industry moving to a hospitality and services model?

The managed office space industry is inherently a unique combination of hospitality led real estate experience. With this transaction, it is a huge validation for Innov8 and the whole industry. The industry is extremely positive with the potential of office spaces market.

How would you define hospitality in the workplace world?

More than desks, chairs, coffee and office infrastructure, workspaces should provide the environment and support to make every company and coworkers grow and do their best work. Our community and value-added services make Innov8 a second home; creating an ethos of happiness at the workplace.

Would you say the Indian market is specific for this kind of approach?

Indian market is ripe for managed office spaces. India is one of the most penetrated markets by managed offices.

Startups are driving the coworking demand in India. Do you see or expect coworking to become a solution for SME and bigger corporations? Is it already happening? What’s Innov8 experience on those regards?

It is already happening. SME and bigger corporates now accepting the trend and it is beneficial for both the industry. Managed offices are the way to go for any workspace needs. At Innov8, we have already been focussing on and catering to ME and corporation. Majority of our clients are SME or corporates.

What are the specific challenges Indian coworking players have to face, nowadays, to keep up with the pace of growth?

Identify prime properties, capital, and speed of scale.

Lately, we are reading that big international players such as Airbnb are also looking towards the coworking business. Do you think this can work? Why?

The coworking or managed office market is huge with rooms for different price points and variation of the product/ service.

Do OYO and Innov8 have plans to grow beyond India?

We plan to expand and cater to the huge Indian market first.

In general, Indian coworking brands are not very active outside India, yet. Do you expect it to change? 

Yes, most definitely. There is a lot of potential. Having said that, we are currently focused on strengthening our business in India. Once we have nailed it, then the sky’s the limit.

TSH (The Student Hotel) has been developing  a co-living and coworking offering for more than a decade. Founded in The Netherlands by Charlie McGregor, a Scot born in Edinburgh, TSH operates 10 locations in various cities in Europe, among which Rotterdam, Amsterdam, The Hague, Eindhoven, Paris or Barcelona. TSH plans to open up a total of 40 locations in European cities by 2021. Florence, Dresden, Bologna, Madrid, Berlin, Rome, Vienna or Toulouse are in the pipe.

Hi Charlie, can you introduce yourself and tell us about how The Student Hotel started?

Charlie McGregor

My father built the first purpose-built student rooms in Edinburgh, where I grew up.  At 25 I bought a small student accommodation company and sold it 10 years later when I moved from London to Amsterdam and started The Student Hotel. The first Student Hotel project was completed just as the full implications of the global financial crisis unfolded. But we pressed on.  

You offer many different perks within all your locations, going from hotel services, gym, food, up to coworking spaces (TSH Collab). Do you operate everything yourself ? 

We operate the accommodation and coworking ourselves.  In some we also operate The Commons – our restaurants and bar brand; in other places we work in collaboration with local companies.  In Florence, for example, we partner with local restaurant, La Menagere and at TSH Campus in Barcelona the partnership is with Grupo Raval.  At TSH Amsterdam City we have an Olympic length (50m) pool and crossfit Vondelgym run by local celebrity athletes.

Is TSH a student only place, as the name indicates it?

TSH is much more than student accommodation. We have students staying for a term or a year, but we also have hotel and co-living guests.  That’s just on the accommodation side.  Then there’s the local startups and entrepreneurs in our Collab coworking spaces, classrooms and auditorium.  All our hotels are open to the local community who come to enjoy the restaurants, bars and super fast, free wifi in the communal spaces and we actively encourage this mix.  We want people make connections they may not find somewhere else.

Why having a specific coworking offering on top of your other services makes sense? 

There was a demand.  Guests and the local community needed coworking space.  TSH Collab was created to answer that need – a step up from working on a laptop in the lounge or bar.  The upward trend of entrepreneurs, startups, freelance workers, and digital nomads is growing fast.  With TSH Collab we can offer everything under one roof.

TSH Collab

The benefits are that all our guests – whether they are studying, staying in the hotel, or working – have a place to connect with each other.  It creates a dynamic vibe that enables people to get things done. 

In addition, parents, friends and family need somewhere to stay when they visit our student guests, they need somewhere to eat and socialise.  Our co-living guests need somewhere to meet and work.  We are continually asking ourselves what future guests will need and add services that make sense.  We call it the Complete Connected Community.

Are the co-living ‘guests’, in majority, the users of all the other different services? 

TSH is open and inclusive.  You don’t have to be a guest to eat or drink here.  You don’t have to be a TSH Collab member to stay or use the communal spaces.  We have an amazing mix and are happy that people can take advantage of the things they want to use. We are a Complete Connected Community.  That runs through everything we do – the community feeling is central to both co-living and coworking at TSH.

Guests and the local community needed coworking space.  TSH Collab was created to answer that need – a step up from working on a laptop in the lounge or bar. 

How do you position yourself as opposed to other workspace operators?

TSH employs a Connector in each location and that person plays a crucial role in all The Student Hotels, ensuring that our guests and community members have the possibility to truly connect during their stay and before or after via our digital- and social channels. The Connector position is the glue that holds together our co-living, coworking, co-dining communities. The TSH Connector is more than just the leader of our fun squad. A true connector turns our mishmash of hotel guests and coworking professionals into a cohesive community of both students and students-at-heart. The Connector position is the glue that holds together our co-living, coworking, co-dining communities. He/she encourages people to meet and inspire each other by events and programming based on the four brand themes of The Student Hotel: Social&Cultural, Health&Sports, Learning, and Career&Entrepreneurship. The Connector is the open door for everyone who likes to join our community because they are the most connected person in our buildings.

A true connector turns our mishmash of hotel guests and coworking professionals into a cohesive community of both students and students-at-heart.

You don’t introduce yourself so much as just an accommodation provider, and focus more on the co-living side. What is the difference between the two concepts? 

Our student guests can stay for a term to a year as part of their international studies.  Co-living guests are usually with us for a couple of weeks to a few months; digital nomads, freelancers or contractors who find themselves in a new city for work.  Hotel guests usually stay from a night or two or a week.  The co-living element comes from the community feel – we don’t differentiate, we don’t separate.  Everyone gets to live side by side, use the same facilities, regardless of how long they are with us.

The co-living element comes from the community feel – we don’t differentiate, we don’t separate.

By 2020, you expect partnerships with 1.500 universities. Do you position yourself as the solution provider to move away from the “student housing crisis” that some campus face, with innovative models? 

The world of higher education and training is subject to massive changes: rising international student mobility; transnational campuses, online learning, summer schools and life-long learning have dramatically altered the demand for accommodation. We see a growing demand for short-term and flexibility coupled with a sense community and shared values and purpose. It was a void between hotels and student dorms that TSH is filling with its variety of coliving arrangements. In that sense we are complimentary to the current offering.  

It was a void between hotels and student dorms that TSH is filling with its variety of coliving arrangements.

Based on your experience, should the coworking industry take its inspiration from the accommodation and hospitality industries?

We should take our inspiration from everywhere; the reason CO applies now to living and working shows a growing space of new opportunities. Hospitality teaches us the importance of service. Accommodation, the importance of a home and a sense of community. At the current architecture biennale in Venice the Dutch pavilion is dedicated to Work and it underlines that since Yoko Ono and John Lennon demonstrated for peace in bed we have started using the bedroom as a space to work. We constantly see new opportunities to improve our concept and operational model; new technology enables us to connect and stay in touch with our growing customer base while the way our customers study, travel, sleep and work is changing year on year.  We see more and more barriers between hotels, office space, restaurants and residences being broken down. That is why is say we are – also operationally – a Complete Connected Community. Hybrids like The Student Hotel will become the norm as we are satisfying more needs than just a place to work or a roof over your head.

Since Yoko Ono and John Lennon demonstrated for peace in bed we have started using the bedroom as a space to work.

In France, the Trigano family is a close to a legend. Decades ago, Gilbert Trigano founded the worldwide famous ‘Club Med‘ brand. In 2017, his grandson Jeremie is now walking in his shoes. Mama Works is a network of coworking spaces inspired by their experience in the hotel industry, especially with the Mama Shelter brand, a collection of designed by Philippe Starck hotels, with locations now in a handful of cities in Europe and North America.

Hi Jeremie. Can you introduce Mama Works?

Mama Works aims to combine the creative and entertainment know how of our hotel brand Mama Shelter, as well as the real estate expertise of our partners. After having modified the shape of the hotel industry in France, we wanted to take on a new challenge by developing an alternative to traditional office spaces. A new generation of “workers”, eager to work in a friendly and stimulating atmosphere is emerging. The workplace is no longer just an office but a place to live and share and that’s why we created. This subtle blend of expertise and fun has given birth, we think, to a stimulating community buzzing with ideas and fizzing with energy! 

We use to say that coworking is to become an industry similar to the hotel industry. Do you agree?

We absolutely agree that the flexible workplace environment is starting to reflect the hotel industry. Like hotels, coworking spaces are segmented, vary in sizes, specialise in niches, offer different services, and start working with OTAs (online booking services) to sell empty desks.

Why, would you say, are hospitality service professionals well or better positioned than others to address the need for workers and companies for new work environments?

We are in the service business when most of the big coworking structures are run by real estate professionals and funds. As such we are here to serve our clients and sell them an experience, not an office desk!

We are in the service business when most of the big coworking structures are run by real estate professionals and funds. 

The Accor Group (one of the world leaders within the hotel industry) is one of your shareholders. Is it important to be supported by such a major world player?

Mama Shelter (the hotel brand from which Mama Works comes) has kept its full independence. We run Mama Works as a division of Mama Shelter. We have launched a start up within our start up!

A real estate broker has been assigned (Cushman & Wakefield) to market your work facility to tenants. How receptive are real estate brokers to the coworking model, would you say?

Brokers are highly responsive and understand there is a switch in the consumption of office space. They also realise there is a gap to fill in the commercialisation of these spaces. However, I believe the brick and mortar approach to selling offices spaces will slowly be replaced by online distribution channels offering the capacity to filter your searches by interest. 

How is your broker rewarded?

A nice commission.

Why not putting a proper sales force in place?

We have a sales team in place but as for hotels in some instances, it is more cost effective to use third parties which have a broader reach.

Are the Mama Shelter hotels and the new Mama Works offerings connected?

We are currently offering our Mama Works members a special rate in all Mama Shelter properties.
We are also giving special Mama Mobile (daily desk rentals) rates at our Mama Works locations to our Mama Shelter residents. Eventually, we will have coworking spaces inside our hotels and really have an integrated offering. 

One speaks more and more about coworking and co-living. Is it a bundle you might be exploring?

Yes, we are already looking into it.

How ambitious are Mama Works plans? Do you plan to stay in France only or are you considering an international expansion?

Pretty ambitious. We are going to use Mama Works Lyon as a laboratory. We already signed a site in Bordeaux opening in a few months and Lille in 2018. We have plans to expand internationally and have already signed a location in Europe…

Is the franchise model we see in the hotel industry appropriate for the coworking world, would you say?

Mama Shelter does no franchise. But we believe Mama Works is the ideal business model for franchise. Unlike the hotel industry, the coworking world relies on very few employees. It is easier to set up a franchise with 4 staff members and as long as we can keep a say on recruitment (not operations) we believe our concept can grow as a franchise model!

It is easier to set up a franchise with 4 staff members and as long as we can keep a say on recruitment (not operations) we believe our concept can grow as a franchise model!

How would you say you position Mama Works (in terms of target, tenants’ profile,…) as opposed to other independent of international coworking players?

We are trying to position Mama Works as an urban kibbutz for coworkers. We want our community to feed on each other and grow organically. Mama Works is chic, high tech, affordable but most importantly human, friendly and lively.

It’s not a secret that the Real Estate industry is wondering how to deal with the growing phenomenon of coworking. The flexible model could slowly disrupt the traditional office market. New concepts have emerged.

Jean-Yves Huwart

The landscape remains blurry, though, for outsiders. Many traditional players keep struggling to make the distinction between the wide variety of offerings: serviced office, coworking, shared workspace, incubator, business centers, fablabs, etc.

As a matter of facts, instead of looking at the individual models, we think the challenge is nowadays to consider the emergence of a whole new hospitality industry, similar to hotels or restaurants.

This is the focus of the interview:

Could you start by outlining the key functions and objectives of Social Workplaces?

We have been involved in the Coworking movement since 2010 (that year we organised the first Coworking Europe conference), and started to link up coworking communities from Europe and beyond.

From a few dozens of coworking spaces in operation around the world eight to ten years ago, we have witnessed an increase to up to 13.000 units as of today worldwide, according to the Deskmag Global Survey 2017 which is supported by SocialWorkplaces.com.

Through these years, we have had the opportunity to interview and talk with many tenants and operators. We have become more and more convinced that what coworking brought, first for freelancers and start-ups, was an actual re-invention of the function of the workplace, broadly speaking, for the digital age. This was for any kind of workplace, any category of employer.

Once the ability to access your production tools has become ubiquitous, why is there a need for you to have a workplace? For us, coworking provided the answer: people need to be in touch with other people with whom they like to be with, both for their personal equilibrium as much as for professional reasons.

This is especially important at a time when routine tasks can be more and more automated and when workers are requested to provide more creative and social outputs. We call this the Social Workplace, inspired by the coworking experience.

How would you define specifically a coworking workplace relative to shared office, public workspaces (community centers, libraries), mixed workspaces, maker spacers and business centre workplaces?

Coworking is open. You can show up anytime and propose yourself to become a coworker. Someone will walk (normally) towards you, be hospitable and make you comfortable. People flow in and out. This is similar to a hotel, a restaurant or a gym. It’s service driven. Usually, coworking spaces also create a proper identity and, thus, a sense of belonging that is at the root of the creation of communities. 

Shared office [models] are more closed. Certainly [in this model] you will be around the same people in the same building all time. This doesn’t impede social interaction. However, it will be more static.

Those models are not exclusive between one another. More and more business centers open up coworking services within their buildings and hire a community manager to build up an emotional relationship with and between their tenants. The added value is no more – or less and less – in the provision of a facility; it is in creating a pleasant environment and experience.

Are there significant differences between approaches in Europe and North America?

Europe and North America are not that different, I would say, in terms of offerings. Big US cities, however, have a higher density of startups and digital workers. So we see bigger players, bigger spaces in the US. That said, it’s just a matter of time before we see Europe catching up in terms of growth.

Who are the current main users/members of coworking workplaces? HOK/Cornet Global 2016 report suggests employees in a corporation are also now a significant and growing percentage of users/members?

Freelancers are the biggest category of users so far. They are the historical first tenants because, in the beginning, spaces were smaller and did not necessarily have the capacity to accommodate bigger teams. The population of freelancers is growing everywhere, however, as the new working generation looks for more freedom and self-achievement. Plus, big companies’ headcounts keep shrinking.

Source Hok

Sideways, we see more and more employees within coworking spaces. Corporations have started to authorise people from their innovation departments, for instance, to work from coworking spaces in order to be in touch with the local start-up scenes. Companies who need a smaller representation office in a city also tend to consider to use a coworking space rather than to go for an office long term lease.

So far, in terms of overall numbers, the trend is marginal. We think it’s just the beginning, though. Fast growing SME’s do not hesitate to put all their teams in coworking space offices.  The Office in the cloud (the cloud here being the coworking spaces) will become mainstream.

What are the most important attributes of a successful coworking place; e.g. shared services, social interaction, flexible (varied and funky?) work areas, IT support?

Pure coworking spaces rarely bother with IT support usually but they do provide a stable, secure internet connection. That’s it. Tenants’ tools are now in the cloud. Besides, today, neither startups nor freelancers need traditional assistant support. Sure, there are exceptions, but those are outdated services with the new generation of digital nimble companies as far as we see it. Again, everything is in the cloud. Spaces need to offer new kind of value adding services if they want to keep their revenue per user at the same level as in the past. Indeed, they need to provide a space with human focused connections, interesting events, social moments, fun and networking. This is what gives value nowadays, not forgetting flexibility and the opportunity to scale up or down easily.

Within the coworking industry, what is the relationship between: 1) large international firms like Regus, Servcorp and WeWork; and 2) smaller independent operators?

The analogy with the hotel industry is for me the most relevant. You have Accor, Shangri-La’s, Holiday Inn, Best Western proposals, aside from AirBNB’s, Bed & Breakfast, independent hotels, camping or even couch surfing. These can be fully complementary. Each reaching out to different needs, profiles or customer expectations, all according to the context of the booking. These accommodation offerings are not mutually exclusive, I would add. Depending on the context, you may consider staying at a Regency hotel because your need is professional only, you don’t look nor have time to socialise or discover a city. But on holiday time, the hospitality of a Bed & Breakfast or, even, the fun of couch surfing might suit you.

That said, with hotels, etc., we speak only about a few days. The main difference between the need for lodging and the need for a workplace is the duration of the stay. With a workplace, you commit for a few months, at the least, not for a few days. The quality of the social experience then become a much higher driver of choice.

What is the significance of secondary coworking spaces such as those promoted by hotels, coffee bistros, libraries, maker spaces, etc.?

Again, the element of duration is key here. Working from a coffee shop during one or two hours (depending on the battery life of your computer) might be fully convenient. Noise and comfort are not (so) critical, in this case. This will be another story when you have to stay eight hours a day, five days a week. You probably will look for a proper work environment.

What is the role/significance of LiquidSpace or similar apps that use the Airbnb approach to attracting workers? 

Liquidspace and the likes are like Booking.com for hotels. They are sales channels and helpful online directories. The dimension of service is critical, though. If space fails to provide the required hospitality and quality of service, the trust will be broken. This is a service business. Forget it, and you will lose. 

The HOK study raises the issue of upcoming renewal of leases for many coworking spaces, as many are based on five-year leases. Is this an important concern?

It’s still a bit early to say, as the wave of bigger, stronger spaces is less than five years old, overall, in Europe. However, this is certainly a very big challenge ahead. We are not aware of accurate data about this. A lot of coworking spaces, through their activities, have brought a lot of value back to properties – sometimes to the whole neighbourhood within which they operate – and have not been rewarded for doing so. I would advise any coworking operator to really consider this when negotiating. That being said, we hear more and more of landlords getting in touch with coworking operators in order to partner up. I’m personally a strong believer in this kind of mutual partnerships where risk is shared.

What is the potential growth of demand for coworking spaces over the net decade? HOK suggests overall it will stabilise around 2% -4% penetration

We saw those figures. As far as we understand it, this includes business centres as well. To me, the turning point will be when coworking space operators will be able to host companies with 200-300 people or more while providing mutualized support services without losing their ability to accommodate people on an individual base. This will create convivial environments within full office buildings, with [the coworking operator] becoming a concierge, facilitator, connector, ecosystem builder, etc. Social Workplace will become the standard. Ultimately, we believe that no employee will accept anymore to work in the old-fashioned, dull closed and dry office environment they have experienced in the last decades. Then, expect the penetration rate [of coworking] to become much much higher.

In Summary, what is the future of Coworking workspaces over the next decade; what will be the key trends?

This is just the beginning [but] it will evolve under many shapes.

Head pic. Hotel Schani, Vienna.